Author Topic: Muse on Minis Episode 338  (Read 873 times)

Sc077y

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Muse on Minis Episode 338
« on: April 11, 2018, 10:54:37 AM »
Well, after a long wait, Muse 338 is up and the podcast is back online! If you have any comments, feedback, or suggestions please let us know!
-Seabass-

Dewey

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Re: Muse on Minis Episode 338
« Reply #1 on: April 12, 2018, 10:29:19 PM »
What happened to Demaris and Chad?

LunarSol

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Re: Muse on Minis Episode 338
« Reply #2 on: April 15, 2018, 09:35:27 AM »
Just wanted to comment on how refreshing it was to hear the dojo section again.  I've been kind of out on Warmachine podcasts as of late because they almost invariably turn into an hour of pundits discussing the politics of the community that the perceived health of every decision PP makes.  It's far more invigorating to hear someone talk about fun things they want to play than who won the last tournament and what PP needs to change about it.  It feels like the community needs a little more "love of the game" fuel and a little less focus on chasing crowns.  At the very least, I do.

DragonPup

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Re: Muse on Minis Episode 338
« Reply #3 on: April 15, 2018, 10:22:29 AM »
In addition to what Lunar said, not only do I like dojo, I like different dojo. The Goreshade4 out of theme dojo fills that gap nicely. :)

Well_Dressed

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Re: Muse on Minis Episode 338
« Reply #4 on: April 16, 2018, 06:23:09 AM »
This is the first time I have been back to the cast in a while, I drifted away from the game when themes started dropping and the consensus around was the sky is falling.

This format is really great, solid discussion and great dojo (it is especially rare to hear ret dojo that isn't Elara trip halbs double afg right now).  Very smart, calm but also fun.  Exactly what the community needs.  The cast are all of good skill levels with a great breadth of coverage of factions but also play styles.  I look forward to listening to more of this quality of cast in the future.

On the subject of list chicken specifically you mention baiting them out for a 30% assassination, but something I have tried to do is build something into the list that helps me achieve this, like Kaelyssa with a couple of Hydras for the battle group for example.  But to further the topic I will often also take the "bad side" of the table because if I see a wall just in the killbox I'll happily pass that up knowing full well that you'll be building a bunker up on that spot most likely.  Which means I can get out of bad match ups by being deployed to put pressure on that spot.  Also the opponent thinks I am a moron for passing up such great terrain and might underestimate me [that and I am not the best player in the world].

A very early MoM cast [we are talking around episode 10, back when John didn't turn anyone’s mics on] covered assassinations and it was very informative on the subject.

With the Goreshade dojo I feel you might be able to transition it into the Shadows theme with some reasonable gains but it does leave you crutching on def 14 models.  Infiltrators do pretty similar work as the swordsmen with the two attacks and gang. HRT sub out for MHA instead giving you similar effects as pseudo guns.  Disco is a big loss I will admit but there are ample other jacks which can help do the work, as Nigel said the Banshee.  You can keep Dhalia in as the merc option as you aren't really needing Sylys as Goreshade isn't casting much anyway I feel.  Revive is just a pipe dream for him at the current cost and no real way to print focus like other revive casters; I expect you'll end up finding yourself casting it 1/5 games at most probably. 

Not to mention the take down, +1 to go first and the handful of free points you get from being in theme.  The theme also just randomly solves a bunch of stuff people aren't really considering or seeing when they build it (frequently a lot of AD models with blessed, stealth, natural pathfinder and some above average def scores that some lists do just stuggle to handle with the normal mat 6-7 troopers).  It gives you a fair game into a lot of things.  MHI also give you better mileage out of chiller [it being 2" from memory] where they can apply it further without engaging and then kindly be stealthed to see past for your crossbows.


------A long aside about the woes of Ret follows, the faction is pretty playable but the reason the community is salty and sad are outlined.  Other factions are in similar places too, but it is where the issues lie for Ret specificially.-----

"The ret community has a lot of frustration right now" is certainly true and tbh I think there are a couple of big reasons why.

1) The faction is internal synergy based.  The faction was top of the pile without themes, but when models get siloed off it limits the effectiveness.

2) The faction was build with the philosophy of "each house [keyword] does this thing well and everything else badly, and house loyalty means there is no cross discipline training".  So when themes are made of keywords you find very few models in the faction have two keywords [eg trencher & jr or Mechanic etc].

3) Defenders of Ios is probably too broad and too good for Halbs & AFG.

4) The faction isn't limited, but it also isn't fully fleshed out like the other original release factions.  So it lives in a place where it wants two broad themes like CoC, Grymkyn etc but has too many models for that to work really.

5) Fluff still = Rules like with the Jack theme being very limited (but potent with the two casters who'd consider it).

6) It had a lot of models right at the dawn of mk3 but right before CID kicked in, which, like Goreshade are just a bit all round underwhelming but not outright bad.  And to compound it these models are almost all in Defenders of Ios where they can be overshadowed.

7) First to be fixed is the Legions of Dawn theme which is super narrow as half the models aren't out, it is playable but it is spam sentinels (and the way it is worded right now I expect that to not change, free points and flank are tied up in the dawnguard keyword, the new stuff looks like it will not be carrying that).

All these things can be ironed out in CID and I expect they will be, it is just going to be a very long wait to get there.  And obviously the community feels neglected when everyone else gets a look in before them, and two new factions have come out in the mean time.  What Ret has seen in CID has all come out as very solid and not game breaking (except maybe the AFG), battle engine, two lights and I guess the destors unyielding change.  Ret is far from unplayable but most of the faction does need a look over [at a macro level] and maybe some models need to have a keyword added to cross them into themes they'll see more play in [artificer particularly feels fairly out of place in his theme for example].

Sc077y

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Re: Muse on Minis Episode 338
« Reply #5 on: April 18, 2018, 06:51:25 PM »
WOW!

Thank you all for so much wonderful feedback.  Ill try to hit the points one by one!

As far as Chad and John go, I certainly don't want to speak for anyone, so ill let them add color to the conversation if they would like.

As far as the Dojo Section, It felt good to just talk about it, to talk about the things we want to play and how we want to play them.  We had fun recording it, and i sincerely hope it came across that way when you listened to it!

As far as the ret Dojo ideas for crump, ill kick him and see if he has read them, some good information in there!

thank you all again for listening, muse 339 should be up shortly (just as soon as i can get un-addicted from Monster Hunter World to actually get it posted :)  )
-Seabass-

StevenSwayze

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Re: Muse on Minis Episode 338
« Reply #6 on: April 22, 2018, 11:20:26 PM »
Also I just got my home PC put together so I could work more from home but it turns out it is also the primary time I come to the forums! I look forward to being back!
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